Main Takeaways
- Content promotion goes beyond social media sharing; it should focus on creating linkable content and reaching out to people directly. Link building is a form of content promotion and should be seen as such, although many people don’t associate the two.
- Building relationships with journalists is a favored strategy for pitching content. It’s important to wait for opportunities and follow up with journalists who may be interested in similar topics. Platforms like HARO and Quoted can be useful for finding and pitching content to journalists, depending on the target audience (B2B or B2C).
- Pre-qualifying queries is crucial, and it’s important to choose the right LinkedIn profiles and personas to pitch on behalf of clients. Different personas are used for different publications and queries, and having a variety of personas can be beneficial.
- Link juice theory: Milosz believes that outgoing links should be minimized to keep link juice within the domain.
- Importance of incoming links: Milosz suggests that focusing on acquiring incoming links, rather than outgoing links, can be effective for SEO.
- Relevance in link exchanges: Milosz emphasizes the importance of exchanging links with relevant domains to enhance SEO.
- Misconceptions about link building: Milosz mentions the misconceptions related to relying solely on metrics like Domain Rating (DR) and the manipulation of SEO by black hat techniques.
- Expertise and credibility in content creation: Milosz highlights the significance of having expertise and credibility in a field, as opposed to relying solely on artificial intelligence-generated content.
- Challenges of AI detection: Milosz expresses skepticism about the effectiveness of tools that claim to detect AI-generated content.
Resources
Website & Social Media Links
- https://chillifruit.com/
- https://www.linkedin.com/in/miloszkrasinski/
- https://twitter.com/MiloszKrasinski
Video
Transcript
Alan: Hello, everyone. Hi Milos. It’s nice to have you today and it’s great to finally reconnect after a while. How are you?
Milosz: Hi Alan. Thanks for having me. Yes, it’s a pleasure. Again, I remember first time we met, I think I’ve reached out to you. And then, I personally, I wanted to talk about your business and everything. That was like a wow, such a nice guy. I need to talk with him about,more strategies and then, and how, how the business works.
it’s just more it’s a kind of a me micro mastermind.
Alan: Yeah. Yeah, that was nice. And then we, then I think I, came on your podcast, So that was fun. so it’s time to return the favor. Today we’re going to be talking all about content promotion, link building, digital pr,so I’m excited to dive in. the question that I like to get started all the interviews with, just because it’s nice to have a different perspective on this, is what does content promotion mean to you?
Milosz: the normally, like what people think about the promotion is, sharing people, sorry, sharing content on, social media. that’s really it. But,we link builders. the way we see this is, it doesn’t stop them. It has to be linkable. we are reaching out to the people manually,
We emails, we’re reaching out to them and say Hey, I’ve included your company. Maybe something about you, maybe a quote or a content that I think that is related to you, certainly has. Be connected with, with your industry so that’s how you can promote it as well via email, LinkedIn and asking people, if you like it, share it or link it to it, And
Alan: so the so the way that I like to see content promotion is essentially everything that people needs to do or that should do to get the content in front of the right people. So for me, this is also, link building is a, is is a strategy for content promotion, same as digital pr, same as content repurposing.
Do you agree with this view? Or do you see link building completely separate
Milosz: no. no.no. The Lin building is actually promotion, but not many people see that. they don’t event, they don’t think about that. It’s the keyword, like when you say promotion doesn’t relate to the building. even if you write a possible building, you rarely see that phrase promotion has been used.
It’s funny.
Alan: And so in your opinion, is content promotion more or less important compared to content creation?
Milosz: That’s a very tough question. So I dunno. I think, there is a lot of, pressure and time to, when it comes to content production, overthinking sometimes, and, those ideas, how to do this infographic, how to make sure that is. linkable, it doesn’t have assets. And then, it stops back.
Once it’s done. It’s like a spray and pray. And then, cool. I can, are we gonna, how are we gonna tell to the world about it? Because it’s, there’s so much, there’s so much content going on anyway, and Promotion, like now for how long? One day, one week. And then, You see, you get to, you get to promote something for, for quite a long time.
You it die can grave.
Alan: So I would say for me personally, the approach should be maybe 60 40, so 60% spent creating. Great, amazing content that’s unique. And then the 40%, spent promoting the content.
Milosz: So different, strategy, people have different views, but, I, I like the way use said, I have to think about it. The I’m terrible at the promotion, Anyway. And hence I’m on this guest like this podcast, podcast with you. cause I don’t promote myself, I try to be natural. So if people, they say, Hey, come to my podcast, then know, I’ll be very happy.
usually when I promote myself or my brand, I like to do via conferences, it works for
But yeah, but it’s offline. It’s still important though.
Alan: Oh yeah, definitely. Yeah. This is another like content promotion, Anything that you have to say, you can go to conferences and that’s another way to promote your content, which is basically what you do, what you talk about. So something that you also do a lot from what I’ve seen is reaching out to journalists,
So digital PR kind of thing. what, in your opinion, are your favorite strategies for pitching content to journalists?
Milosz: We don’t like normally, the journalists, we wait actually, once the journalist is over ask, so this is what we do via, this is the other thing, you would have to wait, once something will come back to you and that is actually what you can. You can answer to them, but certainly, once you have, contact with the one journalist and you can follow up maybe in the future, would you like to see this and that, so what you do is, with, you can also build your portfolio of contacts, journalists, usually like Forbes once or the, halfing, compos, those big guys, the actual journalists.
They have private mail, so like a Gmail or something, but they not, corporate accounts. and that’s, very important to remember that if you got that contact, keep it because it’s, it’s like a Bitcoin. It grows over the time. those,those guys are writing more content and become more popular, So you see how it, so the way, how I see this is you’ve got a. And that, that person, it becomes even more evaluated for you, to you or to, to your even client because you have that digital asset, you have that contract with, and you have relationship. So
this generalist so likely is going to publish something similar.
they normally, they are around the same topic,And you. That’s how I see this. And when it comes, right time, then you hit them with something that you have and they don’t have it and they need it. So yeah, so you can do the inbound.
Alan: Super interesting. So you essentially,use Harrow to build some sort of small database of like great quality journalists and people that you can get back in touch with. So do you reach out to them directly when you have some other opportunities then, or do you still use Harrow or some of these platforms?
Milosz: Just one of the platform. Second platform is, uh, quoted is quite good. Uh, how we to be, uh, I dunno if you used, but, you know, depending on, you know, you sa. And you b2b. The is good, you know, some, the platforms are better for, uh, b2c. So it depends how you narrow down or it depends how you pitch it. You know, I’ll give the example.
For example, you have. You’ve got a, a client and you can use his LinkedIn, you can pitch on the behalf. You know, normally that’s what we do, you know, all the dig digital PR guys pitch on the behalf of someone. Of course, those guys, they don’t have time. So if you’ve got, let’s say C Chief, financial officer, financial officer, they don’t have time to promote themselves or either the business.
So, If they give you the permission to use the LinkedIn and on behalf of me, you can write something about 10 tips about saving money in, let’s say, um, you know, for this kind of trip, you know, trip to Thailand or how to save the money, you know, so if you are a finance guy, you, you’re very good with the finances.
So you can tell like, uh, are the best credit cards. You know, for example, credit is a quite good, I’m sorry for that promotion, but, uh, let’s say I had situation. If you lose a credit card in Thailand, you might be in trouble. I, I had that situation and Rev has sent me a card in Thailand. Um, you know, that’s a good tip.
You see where I come from. So, even though he was a B2C query not related to the b2b, you know, even though the guy was a strong, uh, c he could say, so, you know, it, it had the context. So,
It’s creativity as well and the way how you speak with the client. I, they okay with, with being open so you can find another way how to create a link or maybe mention or get a contact.
Alan: So you essentially reach out and you reply to HARO queries on behalf of your clients. How do you manage the fact that you’re not an expert in every client’s niche?
Milosz: no. mostly now these days I don’t do it that much, but the team does it, so thanks to the team, because otherwise I wouldn’t be here. So that’s one thing. so the credit goes to them, so they, I used to learn on own everything, but obviously there are people that took it.
Higher level. So we’ve got a team for that. And, no, they do that, if they think, they believe they can, answer that query. They can pitch on the behalf of the client. they understand to how far they can go. Then they do it by the, by themselves. So they have a quite like a freedom of that, to what they can do.
But yeah, it all comes down with the, to the client and what kinda limitations. Some people don’t want see them, don’t want see themselves. being, let’s say, I dunno, like direct query is used in b2c. It has to be something related. I don’t have a problem if someone will mention me about whiskey, about block, about whiskey.
I don’t drink whiskey anymore. I used to be whiskey lover, but I got the quote and I was like, fine with me. Because personally, I don’t mind, but. It could be something else. And I would say, yeah, that’s fine. Makes sense. even if I don’t use it, it’s for the link.
Alan: Yeah. Yeah. I guess like client query needs to be specific to what the client’s business is about, so otherwise it doesn’t really make sense. It’s the whole purpose of what you’re doing. it’s bringing brand awareness, potential referral traffic. To the client’s, company. And the other thing is do you send the queries to the clients to have approved before you send them to the journalists, or is it all straight away?
Cause I know that most of these things are quite timely. You need to be
Milosz: Yes,
we thought this is gonna work, but, with China, it’s super,engaging because you have to super time consuming as well. you have to be very well engaged with the client all the time and send pitch approval. He needs to be fast. he needs to remember about that, and comes always with a certain time.
So it’s just doesn’t work that way, it’s. So this is the one thing to remember. The client has to be like, with it. But then again, I’ll tell you something, that doesn’t mean that we’ve been always right. we did this on a query, got posted, we got a link, but, it, the client didn’t like it, it happens.
So we don’t have to go to the editorial team and say look, we just changed my, our mind. And could you please remove it? sometimes unfortunately, they remove entire post know rather than just the one so that it affected the other guys.
Alan: Gotcha. Yeah. yeah. So since we’re talking about HARO specifically, I’d like to know more about your process for, pre-qualifying and selecting the query to actually send, because I’m assuming like you don’t sit their whole day and write about every single topic that might be relevant.
I’m assuming you have some criteria that you follow to choose the best possible publications, the best possible queries to reply to.
Milosz: it depends, like the queries comes every day and, sometimes you have a wet and dry, days,Monday and Tuesday are very good for.
they’re usually are very bad. there’s no queries. some of the queries are just re relevant, some of them not. So we don’t, so we pre-qualify them.
Once we get the email, always they, with lots of queries. And then we see how like the team actually sees, how far they can go and how creative. So all comes down with the number of LinkedIn profiles. So the more people from the company you have, the more likely you can. Prequalified. So let’s say the query is about ai.
So you’re not gonna use a HR person from that company to, to pitch about ai. It has to be someone like, ideally cmo, can be ceo, maybe someone who’s, head of technology, whatever. You see where I come from. so those people are like, The key to this, the entire strategy. So the more features you can make because you have to make it more natural and those, LinkedIn profiles would have to be strong enough, which is why what I said before about the CF or guide, so nothing to do much with a tips about a B2C when you’re traveling to Thailand, but he’s got enough authority to say about this,
Alan: Yeah. Yeah, that’s very important. I guess also using a specific persona for the. For each individual publication and different query that make sense with that persona. So how many different personas do you use for one client, for example?
Milosz: But we would love to have all of them if possible. the bigger company, the better. then you can just, but look, five is great. A good five seven is enough. You normally, you always need a ceo. Sometimes C F CM O, the marketing ones are very good. Anything that is business to be B2B good and hr.
So surprisingly, HR works pretty well. There’s a lot of queries related to hr, like how the lifestyle should work in your company. What do all this four day work? they keep asking and all that stuff. So hr dunno why, but realize that’s, It’s a big thing
as well, but
Alan: Cool that. That’s very interesting. And so what kind of goals do your clients have when they come to you for Harrow Links?
Milosz: that’s a good question. We don’t have any goals. We just want
mention. That is something in some, industries, let’s say if you are in gambling casinos and you have a client in that, that you would love to actually talk positively about gambling. There’s not much chance because there’s not much queries about gambling. So we to be open to talk about anything else with just as long as you can up the value and get some mentions. that kind of promotion. So it’s still promotion, but through the other way. Sometimes the queries are not relevant, but as long as they can add the value to the reader, to the actual content, and journalists sees them very valuable. They do have, they do make sense when you read them. That’s perfect.
I see nothing wrong with that. like as long as you can say something that adds the value and someone else is gonna read that and thinks I dunno, this guy mi, but when he talks about this HR thing or whatever, or anything that is related with ai, he’s not a true specialist. But this bit makes sense.
Alan: Okay. So would you say, so would you say the links are mostly to the homepage? or can you also get links to blog articles, internal pages on the site, sales pages,
Milosz: this is the good point and this is the limitation only homepages.
yes. So this is why yes, I wanted to actually say that. the hello to Chris Pan. Cause he’s a good friend of mine and he’s the actual guy who does that
from every day. and then he told me that this is the limitation of my friend, that.
We can only do that and we only, we can only promote the clients to the home page. And then this is when it comes, when it, the funny thing is that the Link builders, actual Link builders, they know how to promote landing pages or blog posts. this is when we are, this is when we came in as well.
Alan: so something else that I’m assuming you do more for this is guest posting,
Milosz: not necessarily guest posting. These, guest posting are very still powerful. Obviously, if you have the connections, can you just add something? But, what’s important is that to look something that already has been published and to look for something that you can get relation. What we do, we outreach to that person.
Let’s say it could be a marketing manager or it could be someone who is relevant. Someone who is responsible for the probably a. I say to him, look, there is something that fits very well within your article. If you will link it back, obviously would have to give you something back for this because I don’t believe that you should, let’s say, begging for a link all the time.
Cause it just doesn’t work. You need to give them something back. So either you say to them, Hey, I have a similar. Connection. This is the website that I can get you the link as well. So it’s a favor for favor. It’s a link exchange partnership. And that works. And this is the completely different game because you need to give them something in return.
while Howard is completely for free, they, you pitch, they take it, they can add it, re-add the way how they. It should be. So sometimes you write a anti pitch, 300 words, and they just use it two sentences. It’s a hilarious thing.
Alan: yeah. That’s cool. It is something that we definitely do as well. for us, something that’s been working well is for clients, that are specifically SaaS companies. What we can do is we can offer free trials of the product to the website or to the blogger. So basically an exchange for them to include the link.
So that’s been working
well,
same thing with link exchanges. yeah. It’s still working.
Yeah. It really depends on the site that we reach out to. If it’s a. Big, huge site. They’re not gonna care about a free trial of a software, but it’s, like maybe a solo blogger that, that can actually use the tool, the software for something useful, that can help them.
Yeah, link exchanges always work. Do you do third party kind of link exchanges or do you do link from the client site to them and then they’re gonna link to the client site? So a direct link exchange.
Milosz: We don’t want to, we don’t want to give out links from the client side because I believe it’s my, theory in the link juice that I believe that what comes in doesn’t go out. It should stay in, in your actual ecosystem, in actual your, within the domain. That’s it. So the last outgoing the better.
Ideally nothing. That would be my rule of time. But, and I see this, I’ve some test. Actually, I can show you that. Maybe not now here cause it’s too many
people would.
but I can show you the
actual test we made when you have that is, let’s say just about you. You get only link links coming in. No, no links coming up.
Maybe one or two, but that one or two are strategy because you know what you want to do with it. And that works very well, interestingly. So well. So this is the little bit of problem with, with a, and with the Link Building Exchange or Link exchange partnerships because they have so many outgoing links to the other parties.
So they exchanging, but unfortunately, the best would be the link that you take from the URL that has more incoming links rather than uploading. But it doesn’t really happen that often
cause those,
those strategy URLs from a client usually are, those are the ones, they have the most links coming in and you don’t want to give out any links from it.
it’s, it’s just
natural and makes
Alan: makes total sense.
Yeah. Yeah. And so when you do link exchanges, what what are the sites that you propose?
Milosz: with the, sure.
yes. We just say that these are the, these are the other domains that we can get you link from. normally we know because we have a very, like a narrow list with whom we want to exchange, so that, that helps a lot.
Then, yeah. So you go to the only people that you, only you understand why you want to exchange with them because because of the relevance.
So they understand, oh yeah, it’s good. Yeah, for sure.
We want.
Alan: All right, awesome. That makes total sense. what would you say today in 2023 are some of the misconceptions about link building that people still have?
Milosz: Oh, you got me on this one. I could talk and talk about it. So one is a, which I said it’s oh. No, actually no. I’m not gonna repeat myself because about the incoming and outgoing. That’s a very important one. the other thing that is a misconception is obviously those metrics, the a d R and the most ones.
And not just this, they’re just like, these are just the metrics. And if you speak with the, the Pub Boys, seo Black Hat Boys. they’re, we know, they’re like, we understand that they’re, so if you speak with them, they can show you complete different view of SEO and what they can do to to what degree they can manipulate.
And that’s insane. we trying to do everything in complete wide way. In a polite way, in the way that Google wants us. So they love us, but they, we also understand that sometimes you see the. And this guy, this you, this guy in top 10 is not this how many links, but we don’t see the actual data cause it’s hidden because they know how to hide those PBS and everything.
So that’s one thing. Misconceptions people say, this is what I see from or from this is what you should do. yeah, it works to a certain degree, but again, Client and you should take into consideration there is something in the back that you cannot see. And that is very important to remember that some people, they might use such, digital assets icon.
Them, links are digital assets, the good links, bad links, but even bad links. They work if you know how to do it. And that is the problem with us because we want to do everything. by the book, I by the book exactly, but not you see big, even big companies that take advantage of that and we don’t even know.
Cause that’s a secret. it’s a, that’s a, that’s another thing to remember. So it’s a misconception that, you believe everything in the data, you believe in what by a, you believe everything. What by those tools are absolutely great. You should. In order to compare the data discrepancy, take into the consideration, there is something in the back.
So it’s good to speak actually with the black consultant sometimes, so they’ll tell you what you’re missing, So it’s something that I’ve learned a lot. Another misconception, to keep it short, I think the DR thing is, like the r d it’s still people keep, keep going about, and I say it’s not about dr, it’s about.
A block post that could be from, as I said, the domain doesn’t have electron, but it’s a well linked, more incoming links, less outgoing, and then you have a powerful link. It might not be relevant. fine. But it gives you thes, so that’s another thing. it can easily, manipulate and you see something as, wow.
But if you have a guest post, it’s great. for example, I dunno, like 3000 words, researched. There’s so many references, outgoing references. It’s great for the ux, it’s great for the user. It’s merit, it’s fine. It has a, it has a massive value. But the, in terms of the s value, it, this is there
problem for the EO problem.
Alan: Yeah. yeah. That makes sense. I agree. Something that I always like to do is like just really looking at the website. Looking at the blog and assessing it from a qualitative standpoint, so if the content is well written, if it’s valuable, if the article is actually ranking for some keywords and
it has some traffic, that’s the best possible link that you can get.
So you can forget about all the metrics.
Like even if the site is, the R is like the R 10, the R 20, but it’s ranking on page one, like that’s a link that I want to get right.
Milosz: Yeah. And which is why I agree with you and, you are my friend. A again, from the day one, not only today, because we have the same kinda thinking, which is great, that, that is the truth, so it’s not about the sometimes traffic, but it’s, as I said, it’s all about, SEO is algorithm.
And that juices been forever. It’s been for the day, 1, 2, 4, when Google actually, came into the market and they haven’t been first one, we have had something before Google, Yahoo for example. so those guys that came in pretty late and look now they monopoly and that’s actually a bad word, monopoly.
So this is something that I don’t like again.
It’s another topic.
Alan: What do you think about the whole fact that Google is working on their own, kind of artificial intelligence search engine?
How do you think that’s gonna play out for SEOs and Ling builders like us?
Milosz 2: They clearly said that, you can use AI as long as it’s, as long as it is. it answers the query. So if the company can answer the query, that is fine. It’s, it’s informative, it helps to accomplish the user’s query. If you search for something, what are best s insights and then doesn’t really matter whether that’s ai, obviously, you can get, top 10 and then the treatment advisor and stuff like that.
But there can be suddenly a block post that aggregates everything.
Alan: Something that I also think about is specifically, As it relates to content creation, content writing, is that people typically, like you mentioned before, people want to read, the opinion and the ideas of specific writers, so they’re not just interested in a specific topic. Like sometimes they just wanna follow someone because they like their style of writing.
And so this is something that Ai. Can maybe try to do, if you fit it with, some writing and you’re like, now try to write in this writer style, but it’s still not the same, it’s not gonna have the same like perspectives, the same idea, obviously.
Milosz 2: When you read more and more, you Can tell that this is so blackly like poor written, or even a good written,it has a good grammar and everything is fine, but these Are the same sentences such as in conclusion, which is you can see everywhere.
You know what kind of conclusion, the conclusions should be made by actual person that has. which is why horror works very well, and I think it’s gonna pick up even more because when people building the content, they can write a certain headlines and they can have the actual skeleton of the content, but they need authority, they need social proof, which is why they, they use a journalist, they look for the good pictures.
They put them in a, let’s say, or for example, and then based. Absolutely perfect content with the actual Alfred, with the actual links, the actual proof, what you’ve written. So the journalist, if he’s writing about, let’s say, micromanaging, I think that was one of the, subject that I’ve seen. I think we’ve pitched and we
won
some in some
links of that.
And we said that, we said to the journalist, and the journalist obviously is not as specialist in the micromanaging, When they, put account on Forbes, they have to have that, they have to have the people that actually confirm that. It also shows that the journalist has made a research.
It’s not just Hey, I wrote something and I think that’s how it should be. No, you need to have the, you need to have a credibility of already, and why, like, all vek is talking ai, but all VE doesn’t have, Specialty about the AI we can talk about, we don’t have authority in the, like technical,
so
Alan: Yeah. Makes sense.
Milosz 2: yeah.
Alan: So
it’s definitely important to have expertise in a field, to have expertise, to, to have proven track record, things like that, that can set you apart from just an artificial intelligence, bot.
Milosz 2: but it’s been for a while now. Don’t you remember those, accidents, roundups.
Have been for a while. I think they’re gonna come back again and, ha is doing the same, they need to have that actual comment. And it’s funny because, I know that, people on the other side, they’re pitching the journalist using charge G D P, but as long as the, the query is valuable and it makes sense in the story because you engineer. Prompt engineering. it’s a new thing. how to speak with the, and use the artificial intelligence to give the actual super output they’re gonna use it, despite the fact that there AI detection, which again, there is no that, it’s, I think is impossible to prove that, this is ai, detected content.
That’s another thing that is,on the top of my mind because I’m still dunno whether those AI detection tools actually works.
That’s another thing.
Alan: Yeah. Like for sure things are gonna change in the near future for sure. There, there’s going to be tools that can allow you to detect artificial intelligence. I’m sure it’s going to be happening. so the other thing is, Basically feel sorry for all of those journalists that have to sift through all of the thousands of harrow, queries made by shitty chak replies that don’t add anything.
So they just have doubled the amount of the query that they used to have just because people are just spamming with which cha
Milosz 2: It can be, if you’re a good journalist, you can tell by writing just opening few sentences, you know that the same sentences, the same words. There’s some ideals, British ideals. Unless you teach him. But in order to teach dp, you would to teach in the chart, and that takes a while you to
him. So It’s far away. It’s still far away.
Alan: It’s definitely interesting though. yeah. Change is always a good thing in my opinion. So it’s just a matter of adapting, figuring out how to work like with it. Instead of against it. So last question before, we, wrap up is how do you measure the success of one of your campaigns? This could be link building as post ha, whatever you do.
What’s your main, success KPIs that you track for clients?
Milosz 2: For one left.
Ranking exactly, because this is what we do. you want to be visible in the set. You want to demolish the set. you want to put one guy down and then take his place because it’s zero one game. It’s true. for this, let’s say I take one phrase. Something popular, something, I dunno. It can be maybe social media monitoring.
I dunno. It’s a good example. And then if you want to be the top of social media monitoring movie at all, then someone has to go down so you can take his place. That’s how it works, which, that’s another misconception, which we can go back again to this question, which is interesting because. I don’t actually see any Google penalties recently.
I haven’t seen anything for the last five years in the SaaS. And if I ask people, have you ever seen a Google penalty? They say, no. No data. Exactly. So why we should mention about Google penalties that don’t exist. Algorithms ones, yes, they do exists,
I’m trying to say is, You probably you have been gain gaining points within your six months period.
Where was the Google update? Because it’s update, you always see that changes and update, release static, and then you wait another. So during that period, you’re building your points and maybe. Then is a recalculation and the guy who was on a position five jobs because he didn’t do maybe not enough good links, maybe he didn’t promote the content, which you are talking about, and he died in, and this is take his position, that’s, there’s no Google penalties, that your client got penalties and you lost the rankings.
It’s just because someone else was better and faster. And he took your position. It’s literally that you see the correlation that there is go to a go to the keyword, like they put a keyword. and then there’s a, depending on what version you have, you can see that, top 10, you can select top 10 the keywords for the last six months.
And then you see, top 10 guys, they were dropping, coming in. lots of fluctuation. it’s amazing, that even if you in the top. It’s so much work to stay there as well. It’s another thing.
Alan: Yeah, definitely love that. Yeah. Link building is also maintenance. That’s going to be the title of the episode, which is like sometimes I get clients that come to me and they’re like, why? Like, why in your opinion do we need a link building? Like most of the times I just simply tell them, because your competitors are building links, and so you should too.
especially in competitive niches, it’s definitely mandatory.
Milosz 2: but it’s simple. Look, you go pull up any data, show them the last six months, one year. Ask them what’s your competitor? this guy, cool. How many links they have. they built certain traffic certainly are whatever, just to filter. Cause you want to pick the best ones. Last year, last two years.
If someone was doing this for the last three years, it’s just no brainer. It makes sense. They do this because they understand there’s a value. Obviously. Sometimes you see CPC goes up year by year. This is the same keywords, analysis alternatives. Amazing. there’s so many competitors, so many players in that niche. some of them, they understand the game. Some of them then do not, they think or they gave up. I’ve seen it. Something they were ranking, they gave up because they haven’t been, how would you say? systematic.
You have to be systematic in that game.
But that’s,
Alan: Yeah, I agree. Both with the link building, but also maybe with content upgrade. Something that I was talking about with a team from ATS is they do a lot of content upgrade. Every three, six months, they go have a look at the content that could. Be improved. Cause that’s also another very important part.
Like content needs to be seen as fluid, and always improving. Same as with the links.
Milosz 2: I got to, I’ve got to agree with it because we’ve got a recently a similar, like a, maybe not similar, but a, that range, that big client that. Said that they actually invest a lot in the content, updates. They have actual teams. They can measure everything. it’s,they know what they do.
They do how they dollar per what is the actual update. They see that certain degrees they can update. Something goes, up, but they still have to have links to promote a certain. URLs or blog posts because they understand that this is not enough. It’s a mixture. It’s an entire edition.
Marketing is not just updating But no, definitely, updating is a big thing and many people dunno how to do it. They think it’s updating keyword stuff, so they just, select a URL and see, oh, I’ve got a sci-fi, I’ve got a, I’ve got a SE branch. Hey, I use this. Let’s some sentences, it’s updated.
You have to check the manual. What has happened? You
people do manual.
Alan: it’s definitely, it’s all stuff. It’s all stuff that takes a lot of time and so yeah, I always recommend people to have specific teams or specific people in place to do it. And if they can have them, they like, then basically they should hire like agencies that are specialized in those things like us, So
quick, quick,
plug.
Milosz 2: Good one.
Alan: All right, cool. So we got, to the end. The question that I’d like to end this with is if you could have any eighties or nineties movie character to promote your content, who would they be and why?
Milosz 2: Hang on, hang on. I got you here. Okay. Michael John Dun did a movie. Do you remember the famous movie with, um,
uh, Space John? Exactly. So he was a, Uh, he was, um,
Maybe
not the actor, not the full-time actor,
Alan: Okay. A mix of basketball in there. I love that. Cool. So, any final thoughts? Any final tips that you’d like to leave the audience with?
Milosz 2: If you are like a manager, but look into link building, have actual constant budget per year for, to maintain the building and to build, let’s say other know to promote other block posts. Have the actual steady systematic budget that, that you can.
Alan: in digital assets, links as digital assets.
Milosz 2: It’s not costs.
Alan: Awesome. Yeah, I like that. And so where can people find you, Milo, and stay connected with you? Maybe get in touch.
Milosz 2: LinkedIn is the best.
Alan: What’s your, website? Your main consulting website?
Milosz 2: so it’s a chili fruit web. it’s a chili fruit.com, which we like. We still didn’t release. We still want to have that one page, and for obvious reasons, which I’ve already mentioned today, that because of we testing how it works, when you just building links to the one page and what kind of value it has.
So it is been working for the last, four, three years. But we also, we looking,to a professional branding. So we end a way to action to, to, to release the, a website, a final website. I’ve got also another one that is also my private oneski.com.yeah, which there is an interview with you as well,
Alan: Awesome. We’ll, yeah, we’ll put all of them in the show notes. All right. So thanks lot mils for being here today. It’s been very interesting, very productive, as well for me in terms of how specifically that’s something that I always wanna explore more. and yeah, thanks for being here again.
Milosz 2: Cheers, byebye.